If chookwatcher or thinker want to come over to this site and discuss things with me in a civil way they are invited, but if they are going to snipe from afar, under the safety of anonymity, and deny me right of reply on their site, then I will have to come out of my sabbatical to rebut their wild claims from here.
I found this on a thread on which chookwatcher recently decided to lay into this site simply because commenter Fred was giving them a rough ride by talking logically to them about the way they go about things.
Chookwatcher: ‘Thinker – Samantha/Fred has aligned himself with another site whose author is a well-known apologist for all things C3, Hillsong, WOF, you name and claim it, he’s endorsing it.’
Thanks for the heads up on being well known. The chookwatchers, of course are under the illusion they are not well known to us simply because several of them hide like wimps under a single hooded pseudonym.
But now to firmly rebut these claims and produce scripture to back it up.
I am not an apologist for all things C3 or Hillsong, either officially or unofficially. I just don’t like hypocrisy, injustice, false information or poor journalism when it comes to attacking people in the Church.
On various sites over time I have stood up for a number of causes, churches and ministries that, in my opinion, have been wrongly accused – usually by nom-de-plumes who do not have the courage of their convictions to put a name to their claims.
I hate to reveal the obvious to them, but since the chookwatchers focus almost exclusively on Hillsong and C3, it follows that this site is more prominently pointing out chookwatcher error regarding Hillsong and C3.
I am with Jude who says we have to earnestly contend for the faith because there are opportunists who would like to spoil God’s work through deceit.
Chookwatcher sites are notorious amongst Christians of a sound mind for badmouthing a select list of believers and churches – mainly those who are doing well and attracting large numbers of people – and attracting followers of the same ilk.
I don’t have to defend Hillsong or C3, by the way. Hillsong and C3 are their own apologists because of the excellent work they do in reaching tens of thousands of people for Christ, which chookwatcher refuses to acknowledge, obsessively focusing instead on anything he can find that is in any way negative. The evidence says that, on the whole, Hillsong and C3 are being effective in their witness for Christ.
It is also telling that the chookwatchers also push a Reformed theology agenda and quote cessationist critics, as well as referencing the antichristian media and atheists as if they are in any way relevant to what is taking place in the Body.
This shows that chookwatcher is a rebel who will use any means or source, regardless of whether it is antichristian, to further his aims to defame certain Christians and pull congregants out of their churches.
Therefore, on the basis of their appeal to the writings of the unsaved and antichrist, their agenda will always be to condemn anyone and anything that resembles successful ministry.
Faith is of God
Neither am I an apologist for WOF or ‘naming it and claiming it’ – whatever that means.
I guess by WOF, chookwatcher means ‘Word of faith’.
This is interesting because, if that is true, discussing Word of faith is actually Biblical, so I do endorse, with the Apostle Paul, the importance of the Word of faith, but only in Biblical terms, and I will always qualify this by quoting scripture, because the Word of faith Paul talks about is the means by which we receive the gospel and are saved by grace through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.
One can only assume that chookwatcher, then, does not endorse Paul’s reference to the Word of faith, which I quote here:
Romans 10:8-13 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.” For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”
As you can see from these verses, the Word of faith which we preach has everything to do with the gospel.
Chookwatcher is always asking “what is the gospel” whenever he is in a corner and wants to change the subject in a discussion, yet he doesn’t grasp that the Word of faith that we preach is the gospel.
Why would he? He’s been led down the garden path by the dominatrix chookwatcher, who has convinced the chookpen that people are regenerated sans faith, á la Reformed doctrine, which dismisses Paul’s teaching that we are saved by grace through faith.
They say that we are saved before faith comes into play. The Word says that we are save by grace through faith. This faith comes by the preached Word of God – the Word of faith Paul has already told us about.
So what use to the chookwatcher crowd is the Word of faith which we preach? They have not understood that, as Paul tells us, faith comes by hearing, and hearing comes by the Word of Christ, which is the Word of faith that we preach, as we have already mentioned.
Faith is not important to regeneration as far as the Reformed crowd is concerned. Chookwatcher has preached this false gospel and holds to it. They endorse ministries that also teach it, and most of them have no idea what Paul is saying at Romans 10:8-17, hence their aversion to the concept of Word of faith that we preach.
Old to New
Incidentally, in this passage in Romans 10, Paul is quoting directly from Deuteronomy, thus bridging the Old and New Testaments with one gospel phrase.
He draws the gospel from the very commandments God gave to Moses for Israel – to choose life rather than death and blessing over cursing. Paul quotes, as the Word of faith, the following admonition from God to Israel before He took them into the Promised Land:
Deuteronomy 30:11-20 “For this commandment which I command you today is not too mysterious for you, nor is it far off. It is not in heaven, that you should say, ‘Who will ascend into heaven for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?’ Nor is it beyond the sea, that you should say, ‘Who will go over the sea for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?’
But the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may do it.
“See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil, in that I command you today to love the Lord your God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes, and His judgments, that you may live and multiply; and the Lord your God will bless you in the land which you go to possess.
But if your heart turns away so that you do not hear, and are drawn away, and worship other gods and serve them, I announce to you today that you shall surely perish; you shall not prolong your days in the land which you cross over the Jordan to go in and possess.
I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live; that you may love the Lord your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days; and that you may dwell in the land which the Lord swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them.”
So Word of faith is throughout the Bible, stretching from the Old to the New Covenants.
Notice that God tells us to choose life and blessing in this passage. He is giving us the option. Life or death, blessing or cursing. He even stood them before two mountains, one representing blessing, and the other cursing, to illustrate His point. Reformed thinking denies choice. It says we are regenerated against our will, sans faith, and that our will has no place in salvation.
That is why Reformed theology folk will never grasp what Paul is telling the Romans at chapter 10. They are stuck in chapter 9, having completely ignored chapter 8. Their selectiveness in scripture reveals their lack of will to comply with the Word despite their claims of Sola Scriptura.
Five times the Bible tells us that the just shall live by faith. Without faith it is impossible to please God.
In fact the Mosaic Law was in place as a schoolmaster guarding Israel, until Christ, the promised Seed of Abraham, to bring us to the place of faith in Christ Jesus, and this Abraham, to whom righteousness was accredited through faith, is called the father of faith to those who believe (Galatians 3).
The Bible is the Word of faith because we are people of faith, and everything in our lives revolves around faith in God.
Ask and you shall receive
Which brings us to the next point:
If chookwatcher means by ‘naming it and claiming’ the teaching that otherwise goes by the name ‘name it and claim it’, then I certainly do not endorse what they believe it is, and never have. It is presumptuous to claim that you can simply name something and it will come to you. Besides, ‘name it claim it’ was not a tag given by any preachers I have heard of, but rather by mischievous opponents of the faith teachers of the end of the 20th century.
However, I do believe and endorse the Word of God that tells us that we can ask anything according to God’s will and He will hear us, and, if He hears us, He will do whatever we ask for. That is scripture. That is what the Word says.
1 John 5:14-15 Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him.
I also endorse what Jesus says when He admonishes us to ‘ask, and you shall receive, seek and you shall find, and knock, and the door shall be opened.’
Matthew 7:7-12 Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.
Or what man is there among you who, if his son asks for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent?
If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask Him!
Therefore, whatever you want men to do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets.
I agree with Jesus when He says we should speak to the mountain in faith and command it to be cast into the sea, and it will. It’s all about trusting what Jesus says and doing so in faith, that is, assurance and confidence in God’s Word. I endorse His words when He reminds us to believe we receive what we ask for when we pray, otherwise, why pray?
Mark 11:22-24 So Jesus answered and said to them, “Have faith in God.
For assuredly, I say to you, whoever says to this mountain, ‘Be removed and be cast into the sea,’ and does not doubt in his heart, but believes that those things he says will be done, he will have whatever he says.
Therefore I say to you, whatever things you ask when you pray, believe that you receive them, and you will have them.”
Did you see that? Jesus speaking. His words. God’s Word. If we can’t be confident that God hears our prayer and grants our requests when we pray according to His Word, then why would we bother? Faith is trusting in God and taking Him at His Word. Only the disobedient and rebellious reject Christ’s words.
I agree with the words of the writer of Hebrews who tells us to hold fast our confession of hope. We are not of those who draw back unto perdition. We are those who are of faith, and stay in faith.
As Jesus said, “out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks’. The heart is revealed by our words. So we have to garrison our heart, guard our words and know what to say, because we will be judged for every idle word. As Jesus says, by our words we are saved or by our words we are condemned.
God judges our words
The chookwatchers are careless with their words.
They think they can say anything about anyone and nothing will happen to them. Maybe the world will leave them alone and let them be a blight on the Church, since they love the world and quote from the world’s media and secularised atheists.
They have deliberately allowed themselves to be the inroad into the church for the world media’s opinion, so what is it to the world if there are groups like the chookwatchers who oppose God’s move by denying the importance of the Word of faith that we preach and rather quote the writings of the antichurch press?
Well, let God decide what is to be done.
I choose to go with His Word. That is why we are constantly in the Word. We trust the Word of God. We believe He means what He says, and says what He means.
God loves the man or woman of faith. Jesus commended those who had faith in His Word. He lifted them up as examples. He drew people’s attention to their example, and invariably they received the very thing they believed Him for.
Matthew 15:28 Then Jesus answered and said to her, “O woman, great is your faith! Let it be to you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed from that very hour.”
Matthew 9:22 But Jesus turned around, and when He saw her He said, “Be of good cheer, daughter; your faith has made you well.” And the woman was made well from that hour.
Matthew 9:28-29 And when He had come into the house, the blind men came to Him. And Jesus said to them, “Do you believe that I am able to do this?” They said to Him, “Yes, Lord.” Then He touched their eyes, saying, “According to your faith let it be to you.” And their eyes were opened.
According to your faith let it be to you. There are many other scriptures that say the same thing.
Notice that the original accusative comment about me that chookwatcher made above was addressed to commenter thinker, whose response is very telling, too.
Thinker: ‘Of course they hate the work of the Holy Spirit. Christians who prefer lies to truth will reject Him and embrace another “spirit”, especially when words are seductive and pleasant like the woman in Proverbs chapter 7.’
Charming! There was much more to her comment that this, but I’ll spare her the embarrassment of being so fully rebutted.
The other spirit she refers to is something called the kundalini spirit, which is a load of hocus-pocus she researched on the internet following chookwatcher, who came up with this false claim a few years ago on another site.
Well I straight out vehemently refute that and thinker’s other contrived assumptions.
The truth is that I love the work of the Holy Spirit so much that I have been fully engaged in serving Him for over thirty years full time, having given up everything, including a promising business career, to follow Christ, for which He has wonderfully blessed myself and my family, for which I attribute all the glory to Him.
Secondly, on this, the charge that the Holy Spirit Whom I serve in ministry, and through Whom I am empowered to do the work I do, is not to be insulted or grieved by people like this who call Him the kundalini spirit, which I take to be some kind of false deity or demon spirit.
This false claim reminds me of the Pharisees in Jesus day who claimed that Jesus operated through Beelzebub and were soundly rebuked by Him for suggesting that the Holy Spirit was a demon.
He called this the unpardonable sin. Can you imagine the risk people take when they falsely accuse the Holy Spirit? Calling the Holy Spirit a demon and thinking they can get away with it.
Read the following passage very carefully, and you will see what I mean:
Matthew 12:22-37 Then one was brought to Him who was demon-possessed, blind and mute; and He healed him, so that the blind and mute man both spoke and saw. And all the multitudes were amazed and said, “Could this be the Son of David?”
Now when the Pharisees heard it they said, “This fellow does not cast out demons except by Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons.”
But Jesus knew their thoughts, and said to them: “Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation, and every city or house divided against itself will not stand.
If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then will his kingdom stand? And if I cast out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your sons cast them out? Therefore they shall be your judges.
But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you.
Or how can one enter a strong man’s house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man? And then he will plunder his house.
He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.
Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men.
Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.
Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit. Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things?
For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
A good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth good things, and an evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth evil things.
But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment.
For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”
So accusing the Holy Spirit of being a demon is called by Jesus evil fruit, and this fruit is revealed by the words of the speaker.
When thinker writes that the Holy Spirit I serve is, in her thinking, the so-called kundalini spirit – some demon contrived and conjured up by shamans – then she is not only on dangerous ground, but has crossed over into a place that will surely be judged by God, so I don’t have to judge her for it and I’ll leave it in His hands.
But do note this: blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is an unpardonable sin.
Yes, and as I said earlier, by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.
When critics like the chookwatchers and their followers start making accusations against people of God who do not fear their campaigns to discredit whomever they deem worthy of their attention, they had better make sure they have the facts straight, because the Word of God is firmly opposed to dishonesty and false accusations.
We, on this earth today, may be in a period of grace where it seems that these things go unnoticed, and certain people seem to get away with an awful lot that is wrong and paints a false picture of reality, but the fact is that every idle word is being scrutinised, and every false claim is being noted.
God will have His day.